tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post6199568064869536714..comments2024-03-20T00:30:11.702-07:00Comments on Home Education Heretic: DeschoolingSimon Webbhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10865289865412656573noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-44073975676979455532010-10-08T06:29:59.971-07:002010-10-08T06:29:59.971-07:00Oh, Mrs Anon, wasn't aiming my comment at you....Oh, Mrs Anon, wasn't aiming my comment at you. You were clearly talking about someone you know well.Alliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11321428226929318418noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-75264828016524513962010-10-08T05:31:08.637-07:002010-10-08T05:31:08.637-07:00"' I've seen no evidence to suggest t..."' I've seen no evidence to suggest that people who adopt slumping in front of the tv whilst living on benefits as a lifestyle choice have been home educated. Quite the opposite, in fact.'<br /><br />Most of those I know have been to school. However, it is a poor habit for a teenager to get into and I have an idea that in many cases the prognosis is not very promising. "<br /><br />The idea of de-schooling comes from the observation, made by many parents, that the slumping in front of the tv or equivalent is *temporary*. If it wasn't, it would be called *slumping in front of the tv*. This suggests that it isn't a habit at all. <br /><br />It would be very interesting to look into the backgrounds of people for whom it has become a habit. My guess is that home education would feature in few of their histories.suzygnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-7472517473811640622010-10-08T02:45:37.668-07:002010-10-08T02:45:37.668-07:00Anon-say-The most common reason for withdrawl of 1...Anon-say-The most common reason for withdrawl of 14-16 year olds in the groups of which I've been a part has been unmet SEN's, severe bullying by pupils or staff or complex mental health needs which are incompatible with school.<br /><br /> I agree with you anon.Why dont you do something about this Webb? millions need to be spent helping all these children.Peter and Carolhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13834275662603833577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-42729844982145979172010-10-08T02:40:28.250-07:002010-10-08T02:40:28.250-07:00'I think that it is a mistake to recommend any...'I think that it is a mistake to recommend any kind of 'formula' to people - be it a quantity of months de-schooling or a list of GCSEs.'<br /><br />Not sure who this was in response to, Allie? Simon? Or me saying what I would be recommending to my friend.<br /><br />This is an interesting issue. 'People on lists' tend to be very free with their advice, I've found. Despite knowing NOTHING about a family's circumstances, HE is always promoted to be the answer to every school problem. AE is always promoted to be the answer to every HE problem. Deschooling is always promoted as the answer to every motivation problem.<br /><br />Yet, these solutions are recommended with no knowledge of the child or parents individual circumstances.<br /><br />In this case, I am very good friends with the family and am advising them on the basis of a good knowledge of their needs, abilities and most importantly, desires. I know what my friend's daughter wants to achieve in the next few years and I have enough experience to be able to offer advice on how she can get there.<br /><br />This is the opposite of what usually happens on lists, where advice is thrown out there into cyberspace with no interest in the long-term consequences of following that advice. I'll be standing alongside my friend and her daughter for the next few years, giving information, support and ideas and helping them through the consequences of my recommendations, if they choose to accpet them. If they don't, I'll love them and help them anyway.<br /><br />This is advice within the context of relationship.<br /><br />Mrs AnonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-10526115235851699802010-10-08T02:29:04.665-07:002010-10-08T02:29:04.665-07:00'Another common reason would be that a child o...'Another common reason would be that a child of thirteen or fourteen will not get out of bed in the morning or is simply fed up with school and no longer wishes to go.'<br /><br />Is that information in the York Consulting publication also?<br /><br />I find it very hard to believe that is a COMMON reason for withdrawl from school. Your blog is the only place I've ever heard this claim.<br /><br />The most common reason for withdrawl of 14-16 year olds in the groups of which I've been a part has been unmet SEN's, severe bullying by pupils or staff or complex mental health needs which are incompatible with school.<br /><br />Not on the EO list so am not following this thread.<br /><br />Mrs AnonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-22954454269279579592010-10-08T02:14:22.203-07:002010-10-08T02:14:22.203-07:00' Fortunately for many of us (but perhaps unse...' Fortunately for many of us (but perhaps unsettling for others) there is no-one to do this.'<br /><br />Well I think that you have put your finger on a very good point here, Allie. There can be something very alarming about being completely in charge of your child's education. Nobody to blame if you screw it up! I can imagine that this does make some people feel a little nervous, although I found it pretty exhilarating personally.Simon Webbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10865289865412656573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-69812548108426740702010-10-08T02:04:17.512-07:002010-10-08T02:04:17.512-07:00I think that it is a mistake to recommend any kind...I think that it is a mistake to recommend any kind of 'formula' to people - be it a quantity of months de-schooling or a list of GCSEs. One of the things I have come to realise about home education is that some new home educators are looking for someone to "tell them how it's done". Fortunately for many of us (but perhaps unsettling for others) there is no-one to do this. We have to work it out for ourselves. Of course, there is nothing wrong with offering advice when people ask for it but I think that it is wise not to be too dogmatic about anything. As Mrs Anon reminds us above, people can be dealing with very complex and painful situations.Alliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11321428226929318418noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-16508423753238942762010-10-08T01:22:42.592-07:002010-10-08T01:22:42.592-07:00' I've seen no evidence to suggest that pe...' I've seen no evidence to suggest that people who adopt slumping in front of the tv whilst living on benefits as a lifestyle choice have been home educated. Quite the opposite, in fact.'<br /><br />Most of those I know have been to school. However, it is a poor habit for a teenager to get into and I have an idea that in many cases the prognosis is not very promising.Simon Webbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10865289865412656573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-45838165695873138362010-10-08T01:21:29.306-07:002010-10-08T01:21:29.306-07:00'Teens in real distress or crisis would be a c...'Teens in real distress or crisis would be a common eg of the reasons to withdraw a 15 year old.'<br /><br />Another common reason would be that a child of thirteen or fourteen will not get out of bed in the morning or is simply fed up with school and no longer wishes to go. There are various reasons for children of this age to be de-regsitered and I do not know which is in practice the most common. If you are on the EO list, an interesting discussion of this topic is currently taking place.Simon Webbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10865289865412656573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-37970900752020410372010-10-08T01:16:51.196-07:002010-10-08T01:16:51.196-07:00Mrs Anon, for evidence about the age of children d...Mrs Anon, for evidence about the age of children deregistered for home education see;<br /><br />The Prevalence of Home Education<br />in England: A Feasibility Study<br />Vicky Hopwood, Louise O'Neill,<br />Gabriela Castro and Beth Hodgson<br />York Consulting Ltd<br />Published 2007<br /><br />Figure 3.1 is the chart to look at. Also the second report of Session 2009-10 of the CSF select committee; the Review of Elective Home Education, page 63.Simon Webbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10865289865412656573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-77519447521668508842010-10-08T01:09:50.626-07:002010-10-08T01:09:50.626-07:00'They are liable to become unemployed, indeed ...'They are liable to become unemployed, indeed unemployable in later life. We have no idea how common this is, because of course official interest ends on the child's sixteenth birthday.'<br /><br />How can you claim that they are liable to become unemployed when you also say no one knows the stats?<br /><br />I don't disagree that habits of laziness formed in young adulthood seem to be a bad idea, but that's not the same as claiming a specific outcome.<br /><br />Some children are terribly damaged by school. I'm helping one mum now, whose 15 year old is on the verge of a nervous breakdown, who is only attending a special unit within the school 2 days a week anyway, and is likely to fail all her GCSE's despite being a bright kid. <br /><br />When she dereg's I will recommend a plan for some sort of structure for her, but her needs are primarily, at this point in her life, to relax and stop feeling the need to self-harm.<br /><br />Once her mental health is sorted and she no longer has the suicidal thoughts and panic attacks and cries all the time, then I'll help mum (we are friends) to look at a long-term solution, which will almost definitely include exams, because she is a very capable (but damaged by school) girl.<br /><br />I think the problem is that, for kids like my friend's, a time of de-schooling isn't a luxury but an absolute necessity. And from that sort of real eg 'people on lists' tend to extrapolate and claim it's necessary for every kid, when it may not be.<br /><br />Of course, the reasons people withdraw 14/15 year olds from school tend to be quite different from the reasons they withdraw at 5 or 11 (1st school choice not being available being one eg). Teens in real distress or crisis would be a common eg of the reasons to withdraw a 15 year old.<br /><br />Mrs AnonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-16771216371840184472010-10-08T00:58:05.850-07:002010-10-08T00:58:05.850-07:00'Local authorities have noticed a third spike ...'Local authorities have noticed a third spike in de-registration from schools.'<br /><br />Reference please? I'd love to see these stats. <br /><br />Mrs AnonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7881402584568285627.post-12575405794696098012010-10-08T00:35:07.826-07:002010-10-08T00:35:07.826-07:00Teenagers, exams and employability are not a singl...Teenagers, exams and employability are not a single issue. Teenagers who take and pass GCSEs have no guarantee of a job, so employment is one issue. Some of them might have GCSEs and available work but not be employable - attitude and life skills are just as important as literacy and numeracy in many workplaces. Then there's the issue of school. Most 14 year olds are to all intents and purposes adults, but keeping them in a system that gives them little control over their own learning can cause more problems than it solves. <br /><br />The concept of 'de-schooling' has arisen, not because of some theory of detoxification, but because parents have found that after a period of a few months slumping in front of the tv, the teenager has started wanting to learn. I've seen no evidence to suggest that people who adopt slumping in front of the tv whilst living on benefits as a lifestyle choice have been home educated. Quite the opposite, in fact.suzygnoreply@blogger.com