I have talked before about how careful we must be in looking at research into homeschooling in the USA and then applying the conclusions to home education in this country. The very fact that the favoured name for the activity in America is homeschooling provides a clue as to why this should be. Looking at big studies in America, such as Rudner's Achievement and demographics of home school pupils in 1999, indicates what I mean by this. The typical profile of the American parent who keeps her children at school looks very different from British home educators.
The parents in these families were educated to a higher level than average. In a quarter of families one or both parents were qualified teachers. The percentage of parents who were married was higher than the national average, perhaps connected with the fact that many of these families were devoutly religious evangelical Christianity being the most common denomination. The mothers tended to stay at home and those who did work only did so part-time. This is hardly a surprise. These look like very conventional families, where the father goes out to work and the mother stays at home with the children. The whole family worship in church on Sundays. This is a lifestyle and family structure which is less common in this country. Overall, only 6 per cent of the families belonged to ethnic minorities, compared with around 30 percent nationally.
I think that if we were to poll the members of organisations such as Education Otherwise, HEAS and Home Education UK, a rather different picture might emerge. Of course in both countries there is a wide range of home educating parents, ranging from conservative Christians to left wing atheists, but on the whole, the picture is very different. This is reflected in the nature of the main organisations for home educators. In the USA are groups like the Home School Legal Defense Association, while in this country we have the ones which I mention above. Education Otherwise would probably be relaxed about a same sex couple raising a child or about abortion, while very few home educators in this country are probably in favour of regular physical punishment of children.
In America, the situation is so different, that some parents here might have trouble grasping the the sort of things which so many homeschoolers take for granted in the USA. For example the HSLDA are very passionate about guns, among other things. When the government passed a law banning the possession of a gun within a thousand feet of a school, the HSLDA was outraged at this violation of rights and supported its repeal. A lot of these people tend to be very strongly anti-abortion and anti-gay as well, probably not typical positions for home educators here. (Interestingly, the woman who runs the Friends of Dominic Johanssons group lives in Pennsylvania and is active in both fields, being particularly enraged by homosexuality). Another 'right' that many American homeschoolers are very determined about is the right to hit their children and insist that they follow the family religious practice. This is why the HSLDA is so opposed to the American ratification of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child. Only two countries in the world have not signed this; America and Somalia!
For my own part, I am quite relaxed about all this. I suspect that I have a little more in common with this sort of conservative approach which tends to be slanted towards structure education than I do towards the laid back, wooly liberal attitudes which I see a lot here. I do think though that it is well for parents in this country to be aware of these differences. If you are a liberal Humanist who is all in favour of gay rights, a woman's right to abortion and opposed to guns and beating children, then it might be as well to stop a little and think carefully about the kind of campaigns which might attract somebody with precisely opposite views to your own. Otherwise, you might find yourself in some very strange company indeed and aligned by implication with some causes which you would probably run a mile from in your own country.
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I don't suppose this is news to many people, Simon. I've always been aware of these differences.
ReplyDeleteYes, you may be right Allie. I didn't know though if most parents here were aware of the pro-gun lobby, anti-gay and anti-abortion aspects of the thing.
ReplyDeleteyou taking any LA staff out on a dinner date yet Webb?
ReplyDeleteI agree with Allie tha the differences are fairly obvious (not just re home ed- I often read a news report about something in the US and think "how odd" - there are vast cultural differences sometimes). However I also think that if you spend too much time reading only the main HE lists, then you also get a skewed view of the HE world. At the camp I visited on Saturday there were only 36 families, but since the average family size must have been 6 children (Christian HE families tend to be almost as big as their US counterparts) that was quite a big group. The children there probably will be living a life far removed from the average activities of the young people at HEFES, for example. (I am not trying to make value judgements here...just pointing out the differences!) I have no idea on the views on gun ownership (not really relevant to life in the UK) but am pretty sure that the general consensus on abortion, marriage, same sex relationships etc would be the same as their US counterparts. Current discussions on the main UK evangelical Christian HE list are on modesty, minibus insurance and timelines for use in history. This group is pretty serious about the home education of their children, and so if you mixed in that sort of world the UK/US differences wouldn't be so extreme. Interestingly a group of Christian home educators who don't live too far from you, Simon, are discussing setting up something like this http://www.nsa.edu/ for their children in the future.
ReplyDeleteJudging by the kind of question you have been asking me lately Mr. Williams, 'it is not against the law for 2 gay men to home educate?'
ReplyDeleteI can't help wondering who you are planning to take on a date.
Yes we have many Christian home educators in Essex Julie; Brethren, Witnesses and a bunch of Hutterites. Never the less, when you read a newspaper headline about home education, such as 'Home educators are angry' or 'Home educators reject review', it is likely to be a group like Education Otherwise. They do seem more representative of mainstream home education. In America, the conservative Christian strand seems to be the mainstream and the unschoolers less prominent. Cetainly if you look at the research here and in the States, two different dominant styles show up. I suppose I am just tickled by seeing left wing pro abortion and gay rights parents teaming up with those who are vehemently opposed to both practices. The irony of the thing amused me.
ReplyDeleteOld Simon says-Judging by the kind of question you have been asking me lately Mr. Williams, 'it is not against the law for 2 gay men to home educate?'
ReplyDeleteI can't help wondering who you are planning to take on a date.
you not said Webb if you accept that is not aginst the law for 2 gay men to home educate a child? yes or no will do?
"you not said Webb if you accept that is not aginst the law for 2 gay men to home educate a child? yes or no will do?"
ReplyDeleteI see no legal impediment whatever to your plans Mr. Williams and you certainly have my blessing.
you trying to be funny Webb? your such a loser Webb. the children bill went down the drain thanks to Peter and others!
ReplyDeletewhat does it feel like to be on the losing side Webb? are you regretting your support of Badman?Labour?
how come you want other parents to wait in anther room why they children are interviewd by box ticking council staff but you stayed in the room with your daughter did you not trust the LA staff to keep his hands to himself/herself
you tring to be funny Webb? your a loser the children bill went down the drain thanks to Peter!
ReplyDeletehow come you want other children to be interviewed with out parent in same room but you stayed in the room with your daughter? did you not trust LA staff to keep they hands off your daughter?
'you trying to be funny Webb?'
ReplyDeleteNot at all, I was just trying to answer your questions to the best of my ability. I am a little puzzled though at your wanting to discuss such an issue with me. I would have thought that Carol would be the first person to whom you spoke about this.
your such a loser Webb.you still not said why you want other parents to wait outside why they children are interviewed by LA staff yet you made sure you where in the same room when your daughter whas checked out by LA Staff. did you not trust LA staff to keep they hands off her?
ReplyDeleteyou lost children's bill went down the drain thanks to Peter i do love Peter letters to crazy old Badman/and uncle Balls but his best letter was to Johnson in which he told her no thanks! is it me or does she dress very scuffy? like a drop out social worker?
i just had some very good news Webb new film to be made about Peter fimilng starts this friday! Peter will put in a reall good word for HCC and Labour party! LOL
what does your wife make of your interst in LA staff? and you wanting children to be seen alone with out they parents? or does she already do this in her line of work?
"I suppose I am just tickled by seeing left wing pro abortion and gay rights parents teaming up with those who are vehemently opposed to both practices. The irony of the thing amused me."
ReplyDeleteIt's not really that unusual. People from very different backgrounds often come together for a common cause. The huge peace march in London before the Iraq war was a good example.
Simon says:
ReplyDelete"I suppose I am just tickled by seeing left wing pro abortion and gay rights parents teaming up with those who are vehemently opposed to both practices. The irony of the thing amused me."
I am always careful about who I count as allies and have been very aware of the wider political agenda of some US home ed organisations. Like most people, I imagine, I have many causes dear to my heart and some lines I cannot cross when seeking common ground.
we dont need any allies as they are NO plans by this tory/lib government to bring in new laws about home education
ReplyDeleteis that not such good news Webb? no new laws on home educaton to be put forward in the commons.
home educators are now much stronger thanks to Webb weird friend Graham Badman. we won!
Yes, I rather thought that you might be a little more aware of this situation than some Allie. There are some pretty hair-raising connections between parts of the American homeschooling movement and the efforts, for example, to ban same-sex marriages in California.
ReplyDeleteyou not answed webb about wanting other child to be see by LA staff on they own but you would not allow your daughter to be seen on her own? why? my guess is you where afraid LA staff may touch her in a sexual way?
ReplyDelete"my guess is you where afraid LA staff may touch her in a sexual way?"
ReplyDeleteUnhealthy obsession! Besides, my daughter was alone with local authority officers. I tend to assume that most people are not paedophiles, unless I have strong evidence to the contrary.
Old Simon says-Unhealthy obsession! Besides, my daughter was alone with local authority officers. I tend to assume that most people are not paedophiles, unless I have strong evidence to the contrary.
ReplyDeletebut you assume that most home educated children are not geting a suitable full time education unless checked by box ticking LA staff on they own with out they parents in the same room?
are you now saying that you left your daughter in a room with LA staff while you waited in anther room in your own home? did your wife agree that you both should wait in anther room why your daughter was interviewed? i think that is very unhealthy to leave a young girl alone with a box ticker from the council how old was she when you first left her in room with LA staff?
as for unhealthy obsessions you seem to have one about home educated parents?
your a loser Webb all talk and no action!
do you agree that they are NO plans by tory/lib government in education bill to go before the commons to change the law on home education?
"are you now saying that you left your daughter in a room with LA staff while you waited in anther room in your own home?"
ReplyDeleteWhen the local authority officer visited, the visit lasted for an hour or so. I just let her get on with it; her purpose was not to see me. I simply got on with things that needed to be done and left her to talk to my daughter. I was certainly passing thorugh the room at times, but I felt no need to be present throughout the entire hour. Why should I?
This, by the way, is how many parents are during visits. If the child wished to confide something to the officer from the LA, then there would be an opportunity to do so. However if the local authority officer wre really a paedophile determined to abuse the child, the fact that somebody was moving about the house and walking in an out of the room all the time would be enough to discourage any inappropriate sexual activity. Paedophilia is in any case a very rare perversion. I suppose that there was also a thoretical risk that the LA officer would be a thief or arsonist, but I never felt the the need to watch her constantly in case she tried to burn my house down or steal my silverware!
Old Simon says-When the local authority officer visited, the visit lasted for an hour or so. I just let her get on with it; her purpose was not to see me. I simply got on with things that needed to be done and left her to talk to my daughter.
ReplyDeletehave you not heard of children being groomed for sexual exploitation over time? while you waited in anther room who knows what was said to your daughter by the box ticking women from the council? how old was your daughter when you left her alone with them?
you also say the purpose was not to see you? so she never asked what you where teaching your daughter and how you did it?
you also say-This, by the way, is how many parents are during visits. If the child wished to confide something to the officer from the LA, then there would be an opportunity to do so.
so the real purpose of the visits by the box ticker from the council is to get the child to confide to the officer? about abuse? your quite happy to know that an LA officer is coming to your house to look for abuse?
You really do seem to have an obsession with sexual abuse. The purpose of the visit was to reassure Essex County Council that the child was receiving a suitable education. I suppose that the local authority officer might also have been sexually abusing my daughter while I was making cups of coffee and so on, but if so it does not seem to have done her any harm.
ReplyDeleteOld simon says-You really do seem to have an obsession with sexual abuse. The purpose of the visit was to reassure Essex County Council that the child was receiving a suitable education. I suppose that the local authority officer might also have been sexually abusing my daughter while I was making cups of coffee and so on, but if so it does not seem to have done her any harm.
ReplyDeletemany children are sexual abused so it is not good to make fun about this matter! it is a very serious subject and we know that children have been abused by teachers/ trusted adults? sometimes abuse is not found about untill many years later look at some of the cases of children in care?
you say the visit was to see that your daughter was geting a suitable education but you have also said that it was so that your daughter could confide to LA officer? about abuse?
how old was she when you left her in the room on her own with LA staff? or are you to ashmaned to say? where you asked to leave the room or did you just walk out and shut the door in your own home?
"Never the less, when you read a newspaper headline about home education, such as 'Home educators are angry' or 'Home educators reject review', it is likely to be a group like Education Otherwise. They do seem more representative of mainstream home education."
ReplyDeleteSo because they are more outspoken they must be in the majority. Great logic! For what it's worth, when I began home educating 15 years ago there were two large groups that joined together for some activities. The religious group was the larger of the two.
Though the members of the religious group did not invite contact with the LEA (as it was then), those that were known had no problems with them because of their structured approach. However, home educators who followed a more relaxed or autonomous approach were more likely to come into conflict with the LA and become angry as a result.
Why would home educators who follow a structured approach feel the need to object when LAs demand to see structure in home education (as some have)? Some structured home educators have supported the right of others to make different choices for their children but I doubt many felt strongly enough to object angrily.